Can a Christian lose their salvation?

[persons]

http://www.seriousfaith.com/teaching_detail.asp?teachingnumber=491

If I am a Christian, then why am I still sinning so much?

You may realize that your life, your behavior, your choices are not much different than those around you who do not profess Christ. There are two options to consider:

1. You're not really a Christian even though you think you are or have been told you are.Don't trust the false notion that because you walked an aisle at church, or made a "decision" at church camp, or "prayed the sinners prayer" that you are a Christian based on some "experience" you had. Consider these admonitions from Scripture:

Philippians 2:12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; (NKJV; emphasis mine);
Paul encouraged people to seriously consider their salvation and "work it out". Of course this does not mean that we work to EARN our salvation, but that we constantly "work out" (consider, examine, evaluate) the condition of our salvation to authenticate that we really are children of God. Paul gives light to this idea in the following verse:

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified. (NKJV; emphasis mine)
This single verse alone destroys the notion of resting upon some "religious experience" as the evidence of salvation. Paul emphatically commands us to examine ourselves about our salvation with the idea being that it is a constant and ongoing examination. This flies directly in the face of modern evangelism that assures a person if they "made a decision" as some point in the past, then they have "passed the test". Paul says "test yourselves". What is the test? I'm glad you asked....

Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, (NKJV; emphasis mine)
The "test" of salvation is the presence of "fruit" in our lives. How do you know an apple tree? Because it produces apples. How to you know a Spirit-filled Christian? Because it produces the fruit of the Spirit. We examine ourselves for this evidence; we test to see if we are producing what a Christian "tree" produces. There are other "tests" that allow us to be sure of our salvation:

1 John 5:13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God. (NKJV; emphasis mine)
The Apostle John writes an entire book that gives us many "tests" to see if we are truly saved. Here's a few: we can know we are saved if we keep God's commandments (1John 2.3-6); if we do the will of God (1John 2.17); if we love God and love others (1John 5.2); if we practice righteousness (1John 2.29); if we serve our Christian family (1John 3.16); if we love other Christians (1John 3.14); if we love God (1John 5.2); if we confess Christ (1John 4.15).

2. You're a Christian, but you're not renewing your mind and have allowed the things of the world and of the flesh to distract you from God and holiness:

Galatians 5:17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. (NKJV; emphasis mine)
Romans 8:4-8 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God. (NKJV; emphasis mine)

Romans 7:15-20 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. (NKJV; emphasis mine)

Romans 12:2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God. (NKJV; emphasis mine)
How do you renew your mind? With God's Word:
Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. (NKJV; emphasis mine)

Corinthians 4:16 Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day. (NKJV; emphasis mine)

[bhchild]

i dont think we would ever know the real answer :S God only knows and im not sure what i think bout this.

If God can give you the choice to accept his gift in the first place, can u unaccept it later? its still your choiuce isnt it? is it like a human thing where u can just throw away the gift, or is God not like that. I think hes beyond that... well hes God, hes beyond everything, but its really his choice in what happens, hes givin us free will, but he is still in control.

Im not too sure really ug :S i should look into this more hmmmm

[Andy Spence]

i came across a reading the other day that is very interesting.

Hebrews 6v4-6

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.

What do u think?

[persons]

If that quote was correct, then alot of Christians would be doomed as they probably have sinned at least once since conversion. If a Christian sins and is sorry for doing that and asks God to forgive him, I believe God does. What if a Christian struggles with something in their life and has to keep coming back to God over and over again to ask for forgiveness?

Now if we assume a converted person can never lose their salvation, does that mean if a person backslides and becomes a murderer and murders somebody that they would still make it into Heaven? Obviously a murderer is an extreme case. But you need to also bear in mind that sin is sin. Can sin be graded into different levels of severity? I don't think so. The thief on the cross was forgiven by God.

[Woodsy]

Have a look at this sermon by Stafford Carson:
http://www.edenderryce.org/article/item.php?a=857

[Andy Spence]

iv bin lookin into this topic since it came up on the site and brought it up at a bible study.

cant remember where but somewhere in the bible it says that many people will b given gifts such as tongues, healing, prophecy, etc yet they arent christians and that Hebrews which i quoted earlier is actually refering to these people, not christians.

[scaddell]

In John 6;37-40 it says, 'All the Father gives Me shall come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that all of that He has given to Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him, may have eternal life; and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.

Then in verse 44 - No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise Him up on the last day

verse 65 - For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to me, unless it has been granted him from the father.

There are 3 things we can take from these verse,

the first being that it is impossible for a person to come Christ unless that person is drawing of that person by God.
The second being that it is impossible for a person who is drawn by God not to come to Jesus, as said in verse 37. So its impossible for a person who is not drawn to Christ to come to Christ, and it is also impossoble for a person drawn by God not to come to Christ.

So to put that simply, there are people selected by God that will enter the kingdom of Heaven, and there are people who are not selcted, and will never enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Some people might say that ' that seems unfair', 'How can God allow that?'

Then i think you should ask yourself, like I have asked myself, 'Is it fair for you to enter kingdom of heaven, is that what you deserve, do you deserve to enter God's kingdom?' The answer should be no, because only someone who is pure and perfect can enter the kingdom of heaven, unless your that, you don't deserve heaven but God has graciously sent His Son, to take the Sin, so that many can enter the kingdom of Heaven. This is my own personal view, that if God allowed everyone to enter heaven, it would not show his wrath against sin. And if he allowed no one to enter heaven, and everyone goes to Hell, then it wouldn't show his grace.

Now, the third impossibility is that when a man comes to Christ, it is impossible for him to be cast out, as it says in verse 37 ' and the one who comes to me will most certainly not cast out.'

So this would suggest that it is impossible for a person that has given their life to Christ to lose that salvation that has been given to them.

Persons said

Can sin be graded into different levels of severity?

In Bible College a few weeks ago this topic came up.

the question was, ' Will Hitler be punished greater that a nice wee old granny who wasn't a Christian?'

The answer that the lecturer came up with was, that sin of intent and sin that is unitentional will be punished differently and that people will be judges according to their deeds.